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TIM, whats going on here? (#2406)
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Joined: 6/18/2008(UTC) Posts: 978
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Originally Posted by: ttrw I realise more and more, that this software demands that you get everything right from the offset, and unlike most other CAD software out there, VC/ Shark leaves little or no room for deviation, so you have to get it absolutely spot on to start with, or else- your doomed
It is not a case that my constructions are incorrect in the bug reports I make. The reason I post simplistic examples is to make sure there is no error. This CAD is buggy, that is plain to see. It is just others push forward that it is not, or attempt to push forward most problems come from user error, but then dont back up their claim with examples.
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Originally Posted by: Steve.M This CAD is buggy, that is plain to see. It is just others push forward that it is not, or attempt to push forward most problems come from user error, but then dont back up their claim with examples.
Yes, it's odd, this kind of behaviour. I've encountered it on other forums too (I should interject that I too am guilty of it too!), like the Intaglio forums for eg. I think people get very attached to their software they have invested in, both financially, and often with steep learning curves at one point, and then get readers droop at the other- and can't be bothered (and quite rightly as reading text get be really tedious) to keep up with the amount of traffic on most forums, if you see what I mean?
Keep up the fight Steve, the good work will pay off in the end, I'm sure.
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Joined: 2/19/2007(UTC)
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For what it's worth, I have given up hope for an all in one package, not because I don't trust the developer, but because "all in one" mean different things to different people depending on their workflow. The engine of this software is developed and owned by Spatial, not for Tim to control and correct, and it is the cause of most of our troubles. Personally I get around some of the sharp edges by doing basic curve design in Illustrator and some surface work in the Rhino for Mac beta. Troublesome objects I export to Iges format and import again. I would not like to do without Shark, allthough I'm the first to complain when things don't work. I believe bugs are fixed in a timely manner if at all possible.
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>>I know I am possibly just a pain, but all I want is a cad system that does as >>advertise. Steve, I hope you and everyone else that may be frustrated hangs in there. I really appreciate the example files and constructive feedback. You've provided some very valuable contributions that have made the software better which I thank you for. Tim
Tim Olson IMSI Design/Encore
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Joined: 7/12/2009(UTC) Posts: 68
But this brings us back to the original post. Many of the issues I have with this software have been asked in the forums, but with no response from anyone who really knows what is going on. There are simple things ANY Cad program can do that this cannot. I have to be able to layout steel to see where ther are conflicts. Nothing very complex here, and yet I continually run into problems thatothers have asked about. I want to buy the 2d/3d version, but cannot justify in my mind spending money on something new when the old still does not work right. At some point economics has to enter the picture here.
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Originally Posted by: jfc1068 I want to buy the 2d/3d version, but cannot justify in my mind spending money on something new when the old still does not work right.
What? Even at $99?? Bugs or no bugs, 2D/3D at that price is an effin' bargain. What else are you gonna get out there which is precision and ACIS-based for that kind of money?
FWIW, VC has really come on since the days of CU, and where else do you get a developer who is that friendly- especially with CAD. I'd hate to be developing VC. I bet the code for VC is a great unwielding monster! :eek:
:)
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Joined: 7/12/2009(UTC) Posts: 68
Originally Posted by: ttrw What? Even at $99?? Bugs or no bugs, 2D/3D at that price is an effin' bargain. What else are you gonna get out there which is precision and ACIS-based for that kind of money? FWIW, VC has really come on since the days of CU, and where else do you get a developer who is that friendly- especially with CAD. I'd hate to be developing VC. I bet the code for VC is a great unwielding monster! :eek: :)
Actually, Shark FX is way more expensive than 2d/3d. I was looking at it as a replacement for autocad on 4 workstation. Again, why should I recommend purchasing the high end product when the low end one is still so buggy?
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Joined: 4/1/2007(UTC) Posts: 1,583
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Yes, I agree, there are a few bugs here and there, but I have sat down and finally got to grips with the software, and although annoying, it doesn't stop me from actually getting something done. What are "the simple things" you say you can't do? "Conflicts in steel layouts"? Sorry I don't understand you.
Rank: Member
Joined: 8/3/2008(UTC) Posts: 55
Hi guys I see that things haven't changed much while I've been gone.:rolleyes:
Originally Posted by: ttrw Yes, I agree, there are a few bugs here and there
Understatement of the century as far as I'm concerned. Just my opinion you understand.
Quote: but I have sat down and finally got to grips with the software, and although annoying, it doesn't stop me from actually getting something done.
Fair enough but, what does something amount to? In my case I still can't do blending of relatively complicated shapes. Mark you sometimes it just works, but mostly I still get obscure error messages and even crashes. I still don't understand the logic of the Data Entry Fields/Object Info dialog box. Oh sure I can get 'something' done, even do some good things now I understand the vagaries. Model to Sheet, just too buggy to use, it's quicker to get the old pencil and board out. I could go on, but it will just become a rant and it's all been said before anyway.
I've just reviewed some old threads and, sure enough, there has been little progress. I just re-installed my mac after a disk crash and out of interest requested the current version .. still 786 so actually as far as distribution goes there has been zero progress.
I know nothing of Tim except what I glean from the internet so perhaps my criticism is out of order. Make no mistake Tim knows! I still think ViaCad could be a great product if somebody had what it takes to fix the issues.
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Joined: 11/4/2007(UTC) Posts: 515
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What mostly stops blends is illogical parameters for corners and trying to blend convoluted edges with too large a radius. This is true of ViaCAD, TurboCAD and Alibre. They all use ACIS; despite the differing interfaces, they share characteristic blend function. Look at your edge intersections (feature interaction), blend radii and order of creation. The obscure error messages usually refer to the first two. Trying some of your problem blends in other applications, even acknowledged high-end players, will bring the same result unless higher order functions are applied, in which case the blend deviates from your parameters anyway. TurboCADders routinely slice lengths off a convoluted edge until it'll blend to find the trouble spots, or reduce the radius to the same effect. It has some of the same sort of constraints as sweeps, ie when the profile is too large compared to the edge (rail), it results in notional selfintersection, in addition having to respect adjacent faces. When TC first got blending, it's forum had lots of the same sorts of complaints, but they're almost non-existent now, while blend performance hasn't improved THAT much. Blend has limits that you have to work within, but it isn't randomly cantankerous.
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Joined: 2/26/2007(UTC) Posts: 2,156
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Agree problems with "Current Version" are unforgivable .. we need to get this right ! Seems too many versions make this hard to manage for such a small team. Can all the products not ultimately be unified to the same build number ? Just personally - I think the ViaCAD deal is bloody incredible and well worth working your way around the issues that do still stand. I doubt the price covers the company's licensing fees to Dcubed Acis or whoever - so I'm just guessing it's designed down the line to get people looking at the higher specc'd products With regard blending, I actually think we are well catered for in Shark - In what even high-end product do you get significantly better blending across the board ? You'd be spending some very very serious money I can name other tools in our toolbox in which we're not so well catered for. For example - I've used Clogart / Concepts / Shark for TEN years now - and I still can't set up a F$%King Perspective view reliably - Screams ! Fortunately Tim's development of the fabulous hydromatic blendamatic girlattractic version 6 is well under way and will smooth away all your pains .. right Tim ? .. Tim ?
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Originally Posted by: bradcan Model to Sheet, just too buggy to use, it's quicker to get the old pencil and board out.
Oh don't get me worked up over this again! :mad:
Aye! It is true! Model to Sheet, is well.....'sheet', to put it politely! :mad:
I tried to reason with Nick in a series of PM's over model to sheet in SLT. I thought the problems were immediately obvious, but he just didn't understand my pain. So I gave up.
BUT, if I have to do work for someone in a professional capacity, I revert to using QCad, which translates very well into ViaCAD (I'm back to using 2D/3D for now). I can export a tiff of an item made in ViaCAD and make a pdf in Apple's brilliant Pages app, using the pdf exported from QCad. It sounds a bit fussy I know, but at present, CAD isn't my only or main occupation.
I'm not a NURBS man at all. Most things, apart from complex surfaces don't use NURBS, and ViaCAD is, in my mind, exceptionally good at solid modelling.
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Joined: 6/18/2008(UTC) Posts: 978
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Originally Posted by: Tim Olson Steve, I hope you and everyone else that may be frustrated hangs in there. I really appreciate the example files and constructive feedback. You've provided some very valuable contributions that have made the software better which I thank you for. Tim
Tim,
Well, I have hung on but my frustration with this software continues. All I have really seen is a new release of Shark which implements some new tools, those, well, some still only half finished, similar to tools already in the product line.
Yes, there have been many bug fixes (which shows the amount of bugs in the product), but those have not resolved some major issues.
:(:mad:
Rank: Senior Member
Joined: 6/24/2008(UTC) Posts: 591
Originally Posted by: Steve.M Tim, Well, I have hung on but my frustration with this software continues. All I have really seen is a new release of Shark which implements some new tools, those, well, some still only half finished, similar to tools already in the product line. Yes, there have been many bug fixes (which shows the amount of bugs in the product), but those have not resolved some major issues. :(:mad:
Hey Steve,
I agree with the majority of what you have said although I have never tested Shark...I have seen enough with VC Pro thank you. I have no doubt that in time this product or whatever Tim turns his hand to will be great, I just hope people stick around long enough. I have taken time out because of these (and other) issues and I have not looked back, however I still use VC occasionaly.
I dont believe one man (maybe two(Ryan)) can develop a product like this this.....but I hope it speeds up for all concerned.
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TIM, whats going on here? (#2406)
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