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printing 3D (#3755)
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la mouche  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, May 10, 2011 3:05:34 AM(UTC)
la mouche

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 3/14/2007(UTC)
Posts: 757
Hello,

I'm looking to buy a 3D printer to print small objects (watch) with maximum precision, approx. 0,16
microns.

The best calculation efficiency, consumables, services.

Would you useful information for me?

Thank you in advance.

Antoine
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Jean-Francois Jacques  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, May 10, 2011 10:35:17 AM(UTC)
Jean-Francois Jacques

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Joined: 11/25/2009(UTC)
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Canada

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Here in Canada, the most affordable technology is FDM. (Fused Deposition Modeling). The dimension printer cost less than $20,000.

http://www.dimensionprinting.com/


Other affordable technology is : the Z-Corp system. It's like a ink jet printer. You can print your 3D model in colors.

http://www.zcorp.com/en/home.aspx


Personally, I prefer the quality of the FDM.
METEORE DESIGN / KEKO Stand
Jean-Francois Jacques, Industrial Designer
SharkCad Pro V14 B1653
Platform macOS 14 Sonoma
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zumer  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:41:56 PM(UTC)
zumer

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I think that 16 microns is optimistic. Objet, the Israeli machines, claim 16um vertical resolution, but 42um or 84um in x and y, and .1mm accuracy. Those figures aren't unusual, and compare well with other machines. If your highest criteria is micron accuracy, a 2.5D/3D mill, like a Roland Pixa, will probably achieve it most reliably.
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billbedford  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, May 11, 2011 1:36:19 AM(UTC)
billbedford

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 2/19/2007(UTC)
Posts: 186
Have a look at the [URL="http://www.3dsystems.com/products/3dprinting/projet/projet_hd3000/index.asp"]3D systems ProJet 3000HD[/URL] It is the only machine that comes anywhere near what you are looking for.
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la mouche  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, May 11, 2011 1:46:37 AM(UTC)
la mouche

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 3/14/2007(UTC)
Posts: 757
hello,

thank you for your comments.

I searched long and I am well informed about these products.

There is a range of high performance printers with a 0.16 micron precision.

Location: http://www.objet.com/3D-Printer/Objet_Eden_Family/

I'll send them a 3D model from Shark and wait for their results.

Antoine
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la mouche  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, May 11, 2011 1:48:32 AM(UTC)
la mouche

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thanks billbedford,

i wait their prices.

Antoine
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Jean-Francois Jacques  
#7 Posted : Wednesday, May 11, 2011 11:24:52 AM(UTC)
Jean-Francois Jacques

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Canada

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This precision is impossible!!!

1 micron = .0000393 "
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Jean-Francois Jacques, Industrial Designer
SharkCad Pro V14 B1653
Platform macOS 14 Sonoma
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blowlamp  
#8 Posted : Wednesday, May 11, 2011 12:04:52 PM(UTC)
blowlamp

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Joined: 6/28/2008(UTC)
Posts: 648
I think that's 16 microns (0.00063"), not 0.16 (0.0000063") microns.

Martin.
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Jean-Francois Jacques  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, May 11, 2011 12:10:51 PM(UTC)
Jean-Francois Jacques

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Canada

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16 microns is still a very small value!!!
METEORE DESIGN / KEKO Stand
Jean-Francois Jacques, Industrial Designer
SharkCad Pro V14 B1653
Platform macOS 14 Sonoma
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billbedford  
#10 Posted : Thursday, May 12, 2011 1:11:23 AM(UTC)
billbedford

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 2/19/2007(UTC)
Posts: 186
You can get models build on each of these machines at [URL="http://www.shapeways.con"]Shapeways[/URL]. I've used both and the Projet has a better finish, especially on vertical surfaces, and has a 'nicer' material. The Objet tends to be unreliable on wall thicknesses less than about 1mm, while the Projet will cope with wall thicknesses down to 0.5mm or 0.3mm depending on the resolution mode.

However the Projet is really a production machine. It will give you a lot of parts in a day, and the price reflects this. If you are just looking to build a few prototype part then You could also consider the [URL="http://www.envisiontec.de/"]Envisiontec Machines[/URL] which will give you the resolution at a lower price, though there may be other problems using these machines.
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dnns  
#11 Posted : Thursday, May 12, 2011 9:30:25 AM(UTC)
dnns

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I wonder why you think you need 16 micron accuracy? And, it's not that accurate anyway. That's just a possible layer thickness, which reduces stepping. I have hi res parts that were printed for accuracy, but they're not even accurate to 0,1 mm (out of a 16 micron machine).

Once you get to 0,05 mm and less, you're starting to deal with thermal expansion and surface quality and things like that.

So, how many polygons does an .stl file have in it to make it accurate enough to print at that resolution? My hi-res files were huge.

I get the impression that this is a case of buying numbers instead of reality. Not uncommon.
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billbedford  
#12 Posted : Friday, May 13, 2011 1:03:57 AM(UTC)
billbedford

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Joined: 2/19/2007(UTC)
Posts: 186
Higher accuracy and higher resolution give you two things, the first is finer detail, both in terms of wall thickness and surface detail and the second is that a fine surface finish means that it is unnecessary to sand the surface. Any imperfections will paint out. Both these are important to these sort or work I am producing.

The gears on the attached image were done on a Projet 3000HD in Ultra high definition mode. The file size was 61Mb in ViaCad, 8.7Mb in STYL with 174014 faces. So not really too big.

The teeth have been marked with a felt-tipped pen in this photo to show the teeth.
File Attachment(s):
gears-990.jpg (525kb) downloaded 5 time(s).

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la mouche  
#13 Posted : Tuesday, May 17, 2011 1:43:52 AM(UTC)
la mouche

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 3/14/2007(UTC)
Posts: 757
Thank you Bill

This explains very well my current needs. I need to print boxes for watches, so I have to be accurate thrust, 16 microns (not... 0.16 ... :eek:

I continue my research, thank you for your contribution.

Antoine
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ALBANO  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, May 18, 2011 6:16:21 AM(UTC)
ALBANO

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Man
Germany

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Anybody interested in FDM Parts? ->Contact me.
We have a Stratasys Dimension 768 Printer.
We can offer a good price as we dont have to make our living from printing
:)

ALBAN
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